I'm Not Lyin', I'm Sion!

An interview with John Paul Pirolli, self-proclaimed leader of the Priory of Sion in the American Continents
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JP: Every hair has a connection to God.

DR: Oh, "every hair on your head is numbered."

JP: Every hair has an angel of its own. And the longer the hair... Need I say more? Now you have this Nazarene belief of Samson, then it goes to John, and you have Christ of this belief. And you also have the connection with the Essene belief, you know, the Dead Sea Scrolls. So Jesus was Jewish by nationality, but he was Nazarene by faith.

DR: And that means he was of the religion of ancient Egypt.

JP: No, a merger of Egyptian and Hebrew. Every aeon there is a merger. First you have the merger of the Egyptian and the Greek with Hermes. Then you have the merger with the Egyptian and the Hebrew with Moses. Then you have the merger of pagan goddess-worship with that belief through Christ. Mary Magdalen was a priestess of Astarte. That's why so many of the pagan Gnostic beliefs in France, the Papacy wanted to destroy. Mary Magdalen brought that in. She was prophesized in the Book of Micah, when it says "oh daughter of Zion, of Tower of Shepherds." Tower of Shepherds translates in Hebrew to "Magdalen." It all fits together. You have Christ married to a pagan, Astarte equals Isis, equals Nuit. The one who should've come after Christ was given all of this great information, and he blew it.

DR: Are we talking about Crowley here?

JP: That's right. Crowley was a flaming genius, but he had more hang-ups than a Freudian nightmare. And he blew it.

DR: What was he supposed to do?

JP: Have you read The Book of the Law?

DR: Yes I have, sir.

JP: The first words, "Had, the manifestation of Nuit, the unveiling of the company of Heaven, every man and every woman is a star." Now what is that star? When I first joined the OTO, I already had made contact with my HGA (Holy Guardian Angel) years before, when he made himself visual to me back in 1970. I was running an errand for where I worked, and I got lost, and I ended up on top of this hill. Just above the hill I saw this figure. He was holding a six-pointed hand above his head, and a five-pointed hand below. And that summer we started the Sword and Shield with that symbol, the Twin Star, the five and the six.

DR: So a hexagram and a pentagram.

JP: Yes. And when I read The Book of the Law, it fit what I was talking about with the five and the six, the 56, the number 11. And how it fit, you form a hexagram on top, and beneath that, connecting the right and left lower portions of the hexagram, and run it through the bottom portions of the hexagram, you form a pentagram out of those lines. When you put the six and the five together, it forms the Tree of Life symbol of the Sephiroth.

DR: Do these two things represent male and female as well?

JP: Bingo.

DR: So its a hermaphroditic symbol, really. Because they're joined together.

JP: And how are they joined together? By the lower part of the six. Need I say more?

DR: Maybe if you put your index finger inside of a hole formed by your other hand, we would get a clear picture of what you're talking about.

JP: Uh huh. So I had this twin start symbol, which blew Grady away, so he named my OTO camp the Twin Star camp of the OTO. A year later, the Lincoln book came out, and all through the Lincoln book, you have the twin star symbol. I had come up with that through contact with my HGA before Lincoln even wrote the book. This is one of the reasons why the people at the Priory were interested in me. How did I get this information?

DR: Now, the five and the six, I've heard this through the grapevine: Five is the number of Man, and six is the number of the Devil.

JP: No, it's male and female. There's a saying that goes: "Malkuth is in Kether, and Kether is in Malkuth." What you do is, at the bottom of the five-pointed star, you draw a line going down, and add another point, which is Malkuth, which is in actuality the top part of another hexagram going down from that point, forming Jacob's Ladder, one twin star after another, forming a double helix, like D.N.A. Now you hook these things together, and picture it 3-D, it's like a Mobius strip.

DR: I've heard that there's a Tree of Life that ascends above the Earth, and then there's one that descends below, which you just described. I've heard that that's Hell, basically, that's the abode of the demons.

JP: No, no. The whole concept of Hell is another qaballistic story of the breaking of the vessels. We now have the Big Bang theory, which scientists have believed in for years. We qaballists have been talking about that for thousands of years. When matter, or the Ain Soph, merged with anti-matter, or the Ain Soph Aur, there was a reaction, a bolt of energy forming the Tree of Life. Well, the first time it happened, the Tree was not totally in balance, and it crashed into a million pieces. This broken up Tree of Life is known as the Qliphoth, the negative side. Then matter and anti-matter got together a second time, forming the Tree of Life as we know it today. So the negative side, or Hell, would be the Qliphoth, or the dispersed shells. When you take a candle and you set it in front of you, and you light it, you will find that the hottest part of the flame was not the big flame, but the little tiny flame in the center, because the little tiny flame is pure energy. Everything else is a manifestation of that pure energy, or the shells of that pure energy, which is the Qliphoth. That's why, when things look bad, they always look really, really, bad, because the Qliphoth is dispersed.

DR: It covers more area. So then the purpose of this religion of yours would be to enter into this pure energy, or commune with it?

JP: To commune with the energy, to become One with that energy. So we can become like gods. We can heal. One of my Sword and Shield brothers was diagnosed with cancer three months ago, and I wouldn't accept the diagnosis. So I built a wand, I put the right crystals in, we put in the right energy. Now the doctors are saying they must have made a mistake on the X-rays. There's no cancer left. What is disease but dis-ease. Out of balance, out of sort. By putting in the right energy at the right spot, you can heal. You might think it's New Age, but it's ancient age. We've been doing this stuff for centuries.

DR: See, I'm very familiar with these concepts, and the thing is, the Priory of Sion, I've always though, is this super-secret cabal. They've been holding the secrets of humanity for thousands of years. These secrets must be something that I haven't heard before.

JP: You've heard 'em all!

DR: But they act like this is a philosophy that not everyone can handle.

JP: It's not that not everyone can handle it. It's that the Church of Rome won't allow it. Would you go to the Roman church if you found out that you didn't need a church because you yourself are God?

DR: My point is that, you're saying this is the same religion that was practiced by the Great White Brotherhood. That also was not practiced by the lay Egyptians. It was something that was preserved for the elite. Why is that, if what you're describing is, like, healing and stuff?

JP: The best way to keep a concept pure is to keep it secret, because people are going to mess up. It's the fuck-up factor. Someone's going to fuck up. For instance, have all these people tearing up the Southern part of France looking for the Templar treasure. Where's the money? It's sitting in the Vatican bank! Has been for years. Who do you think gave the money to the Vatican bank? Sauniere!

DR: Why would he do that?

JP: Where's the best place to hide money? Right under the Vatican's nose. When you're dealing drugs, where's the best place to hide your stash? Right in the car window.

DR: So you're saying he had an account with the Vatican?

JP: No, the Priory has an account with the Vatican. The Priory money is in the Vatican.

DR: But anyone who's read Holy Blood, Holy Grail would pick up that the Vatican is against the Priory of Sion, and the Priory of Sion is against the Vatican. So how is it that the Vatican is holding an account for them?

JP: So who says the Pope knows? The first Pope who came close to finding out died real quickly. Remember John Paul I?

DR: Yeah he died in about a month. He died on my birthday, actually.

JP: He wanted to clean up the Priory, and he got cleaned out.

DR: So that was the reason for his assassination.

JP: Remember what happened to Roberto Calvi? He got hung off a bridge in London, and they called it Propaganda Due. In actuality, it was Priory 2. Some people got greedy. I don't want to deal with those people. I'd rather deal with God, or as Luke Skywalker would say, The Force.

DR: I don't see anything that distinguishes the Hermetic philosophy of the Priory of Sion which you described from the Hermetic philosophy that I could get at my local New Age bookstore. So I think there must be some important element that you haven't disclosed to me thus far.

JP: Dear lady, it's all there. A Golden Dawn volume will give you a lot of information.

DR: So it's the same thing!

JP: It's the same thing, but it's organized. It's basically the same thing, but with a mass, which people can do together. So it's individual belief and collective belief all in one church. All these rituals that you can pick up in any store: where do you think they came from?

DR: Well, I think they have a common ancient source.

JP: Right. Stuff is given to the people. But in the old days if you had one of these books, what would the papacy do to you for just possessing the book?

DR: I think it depends, but we've all heard a lot of horror stories about people who got burned at the stake. I think it was all dependent on the politics of the situation.

JP: There's no big secret. It's there in front of you. It's already there, but people don't have the eyes to notice it.

DR: So the Elixir of Life is hidden in everyday reality.

JP: Right. You just have to know that it's there. You have to open your eyes.

DR: But this philosophy you're espousing is almost antithetical to what we would think the Priory of Sion's philosophy is, the one in Europe. And you did admit earlier on in the broadcast that all of these organizations are connected at some point. So you gotta figure there's some guy or a number of guys who are coordinating all of this. This is all part of some plot.

JP: Render to Caesar what is Caesar 's render to God what is God's. Those are the people who decide who goes where.

DR: But you're a part of this Priory of Sion that is trying to unify Europe into, as far as I can tell, a revised Holy Roman Empire, am I correct?

JP: More than you know. Summer before last, my Priory contact sent me a letter in the mail. I've got a copy of it here. I sent him a copy of a ritual I wrote called "The Grail Mass." He wrote back (reading): "Thank you for sending me your wonderful Grail mass. It was definitely inspired by the Lord. Karl chose you well. We are very aware of your work. The Elders are pleased at this time. I've been instructed to tell you that your recruitment efforts are to continue with the full blessing of P1. I have been told that further instructions will follow. The coming decade will require all our resources. Our goals for Europe are moving ahead at a satisfactory pace, but the present actions with the U.S. and Britain in the Muslim nations may speed events up in a manner that we do not want. To this end, we ask you to spiritually prepare yourself for the coming events." Then he tells me later in the letter how to "look to the East." This letter was given to me on December the 17th, 1998. The following summer, they had the big meeting with Pope Paul and the heads of both the Greek and Russian Orthodox churches. It's already happening.

DR: You're talking about a unification of all the Christian churches?

JP: They're already talking about a unification with the Anglican church. There's only one break in the apostolic line of succession, with the Bishop of Canterbury. All they have to do is fix that one break, and the Catholic and Anglican churches will be one. They're just working out the details, like married priests. But they accept each other's baptisms, and most of each other's rites.

DR: You're saying that when the Priory of Sion finishes creating their world empire, there will at the same time be a worldwide church that is also being moved into place. Will the philosophical basis for this church be the same as the one you're espousing?

JP: That's what I'm pushing for, yes. Women are equal to men, every man and every woman is a star, there is no difference. That God is everywhere and in everything, because God is energy, we're all part of it.

DR: So the New Age aspects of this philosophy would be made part of the church for the masses, and I assume the more esoteric aspects of this philosophy would be kept for the priesthood.

JP: For obvious reasons.

DR: How many members do you have under your fold?

JP: In the Sword and Shield we have over 500 members throughout the country. In the second part of the Sword and Shield, we have church status here legally in Massachusetts. We have a number of people studying for the Priesthood now. It took the Templars nine years. I'm trying to do it in four and a half. I got my final papers in 1997, so I'm working my butt off training people, trying to get this belief started. 'Cause people love the idea, when they realize that they can go to Mass and not feel guilty, they can have a session between them and God, and not have to deal with a Priest, they can get divorced and not have to be banned from the Church.

DR: Seems like you're aiming your efforts mostly towards devout Catholics.

JP: No, I'm opening my doors to everybody. Catholics, Protestants who get tired of these born again types. I used to be Pentecostal minister. People are tired of these hypocrites who say, "Don't you dare drink" and then go home and drink themselves. They're tired of following false leaders. But they themselves are the leaders. You don't need a minister unless you want one. That's the whole difference. You don't need a church with gilded windows and golden crucifixes. You just need belief that you have the power.

DR: What happens to the structure of society when everyone realizes that they "have the power?" Right now it seems like society is kind of kept in check by the fact that people accept their station in life.

JP: To quote The Book of the Law: "And the slaves shall serve."

DR: So you must have a two-tiered system where you teach one philosophy to certain people, and you teach another one to the rest.

JP: No, we teach these things for those who want to study. For those who just want to come to church, that's what that's for. When you asked me on the other show, "How do I become a member?", I said, "Ask."

DR: And I did. Subsequently I asked, and an invitation was extended to me, and honestly, it was just a little too easy. It was almost disappointed, because I expected to be put through a series of tests, if this is the real one.

JP: It is the real one. The thing is, the first degree in the Sword and Shield is called "Seeker", where you check us out. Then if you pass tests, you get your second degree. But the tests you take are tests in magick, like can you do a banishing ritual, can you clean house? When you come to a meeting, you do an LBR (Lesser Banishing Ritual.) If you do it, you pass the test.

DR: That's the thing. This organization, the Priory of Sion is so shrouded in mystery, and sir, if you were to compare yourself to Pierre Plantard, which is who everyone thinks about when they think of the Priory of Sion, the last known Grand Master. This guy is a real smooth character, and he's so coy and mysterious, and he has this smile on his face like, "I know something you don't." And you sir, have none of those qualities. You're telling these secrets to anyone who will listen.

JP: In the Second Order of the Priory, we have four words on our coat of arms: "Veritas (Truth)", "Agape (spiritual love)", "Thelema (Will)", and finally, "Benedictus (Beneficence.)" We help others.

DR: From the point of view of someone who's read Holy Blood, Holy Grail, it seems like you're spilling all of these super secret things. Is there not anyone in the Priory of Sion who wishes you weren't talking to me right now?

JP: There must be. The thing is, what I'm saying is not all that secret.

DR: But if you're the leader of the North American faction - you told me earlier about all these people who got killed for revealing the Priory's secrets. So these things that you're saying are all safe to reveal?

JP: Yeah, I don't know the bank accounts, I don't know who did what. I don't want to know. I'm not involved with the crazies in Europe. I have nothing to do with those people.

DR; Except that those people send you letters with secret orders telling you what to do.

JP: No, those weren't secret orders. I read them to you.

DR: I thought that letter sounded like the person writing it did not intend for it to be read on the air.

JP: But it's not all that secret. It said, "Our goals for Europe are moving ahead at a satisfactory pace." That could mean anything.

DR: It could, but you and I both know what it means.

JP: Those who know, know. Those who don't, they're never gonna know.

DR: I'm just personally surprised to be talking to someone who's the head of a faction of this order who's just so free with this information. Not just the Hermetic aspect, because that's easy to get the head around, but the things you've said about the people in Europe, and how this is all part of a plot to create this one-world government and this one-world religion. You've gotta know that if there are any fundamentalist Christians listening right now, every synapse in their head is going off .

JP: Let them. They're not going to believe it anyway.

DR: Well, when the New World Order comes into being...

JP: Don't call it the New World Order. Call it the Golden Age, the New Age. New World Order sounds so Adolf Hitler-ish.

DR: Well, he did coin the term.

JP: So did a lot of other people, like Caligula.

DR: Which is why I think it's safe to use. I mean, this plan has been in existence for a thousands of years.

JP: It's on our dollar bill too. But I just don't like anything that reeks of fascism in politics.

DR: But you've got to know that that's part of this! To a fundamentalist Christian, this sounds like the rule of the Anti-Christ.

JP: First you've gotta realize what the Book of Revelations is. Remember, John who wrote the book was on the island of Patmos, which is in the Mediterranean. All that grows on the island of Patmos is wheat, ergot wheat. They gave him old bread and fish. That's all he ate. So you know where his head was at when he wrote the Book of Revelations. He was stoned out of his ever-loving mind.

DR: So you think the Book of Revelations is just the result of a bad acid trip.

JP: Obviously. Read! The colors, the glory of it all.

DR: Well, I've gotta tell you, even coming from the skeptical perspective that I do, the Book of Revelations sounds exactly like what's happening today.

JP: So do the Prophecies of Malachi, which talk about the same thing.

DR: You've said before that the reason why world events today just so happen to correspond to the prophecies of thousands of years ago is that it's just divine providence working its way through people, instead of a conspiracy by people to make these things happen.

JP: It's already in the works. Some things people have no control over.

DR: So these are all just cosmic cycles occurring.

JP: Right. When Malachi wrote the book, he was a Bishop from Ireland. He went to visit the papacy, got on top of a hill overlooking Rome, and had these visions. I can't remember , but I think it was during the times of the Crusades. And every prophecy he made came to pass. He described each and every Pope. Now there's a book you can get called The Last Pope, which is about the Prophecies of Malachi. There are only two more Popes. After Paul there's just one guy, and then there'll be the final guy, who's going to be named Peter. After him, the Roman Catholic Church will no longer be what it is today.

DR: It will be the Priory of Sion church?

JP: I don't know what they want to call it. The Church of Amor. Amor spelled backwards is Roma, Rome. The Church of Love.

DR: If this organization that you claim to be a member of is real , I predict very dire circumstances for you in the future. You will either be dead, or just passed over. Someone else will be given your position.

JP: That's what happened to Karl le Fleur. He was passed over. But he kept his mouth shut.

DR: And you haven't, have you?

JP: And I'm not going to. Because the truth is there. You can't hide the love under a bushel basket.

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